i talked to former president bill clinton yesterday. did an interview with him and he said, you know, with this issue about nelson mandela and his friendships and those who supported him, like gadhafi and ka castro, he said we don't look like ourselves view themselves. when we went on the tour, the historic africa tour with bill clinton in the second term and joburg, nelson mandela was asked a question about the friendships and nelson mandela himself said, look, if you don't like my friendship, something to this effect, you can go jump in the pool. >> yeah. >> nelson mandela himself said this. >> yep. >> and you have to remember, you know, that when people are different and they want to change an oppressive regime injustice, they're called different names. called dr. king different names and wanted to slander him. you have to remember, also, karen, some of the reason why in recent times that they have called nelson mandela a communist is because he did not want to go for the united states to go to war with iraq. >> that's right. >> so,